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Halfrican-American?

My good friend Baldilocks has an interesting question for people that don't think Obama is a true "African-American because his father was from Africa and not a descendant of slaves.

Here's a quandary for all you hair-splitters on things don't matter: since my mother is an American descendant of Africans brought to the US to be slaves but my biological father is an African, does that make me "half African-American?"

This is one area that I actually don't have an argument with Obama on. I think the term African American is annoying because it is not an accurate term. Africa is a continent not a country and it does not attribute accurately to most black people in this country because honestly, we are the melting pot. But, if black people prefer African-American to just plain old American, that's up to them. I'm just glad everyone doesn't do that. I have a friend that would be Cherokee-Irish-German-Polish-Russian-Spanish-British-French-Japanese American. If everytime someone was asked if they were an American and the person had to launch into a dissertation to respond, that would get old quick.

So, basically, who cares if Obama is or isn't a American African-America or just plain old African-American; he's still not qualified to be President.

Posted by Rosemary on 04.15.2008
Ara Rubyan (www):
4.15.2008 10:15am
Jerry K. :
Article Two of the Constitution sets the principal qualifications to be eligible for election as President. A Presidential candidate must:

* be a natural-born citizen of the United States;
* be at least thirty-five years old;
* have been resident in the United States for at least fourteen years.

Last I checked that makes Obama, Hillary, McCain, and myself qualified to be President.

All the other stuff is just gravy.
4.15.2008 11:21am
shep (mail):
"...he's still not qualified to be President."

You voted for George Bush...twice!
4.15.2008 11:56am
TQL:
With the exception of the little pesky part of the last sentence, I agree with you!
4.15.2008 12:02pm
Rosemary, Queen of All Evil (mail):

You voted for George Bush...twice!


You guys nominated Al Gore and John Kerry! Jesus, you only have yourselves to blame!
4.15.2008 12:18pm
shep (mail):
"You guys nominated Al Gore and John Kerry!"

Al Gore and John Kerry make George Bush look like...gee, come to think of it there's isn't anyone dumber and less qualified than George Bush for the purposes of this comparison.
4.15.2008 12:22pm
Rosemary, Queen of All Evil (mail):
That's hindsight!
4.15.2008 12:24pm
double-plus-ungood (mail) (www):
That's hindsight!

It's only hindsight if you didn't recognize it before the last two elections. Which we did and you didn't.
4.15.2008 12:26pm
Rosemary, Queen of All Evil (mail):
Eh, I will never regret picking Bush over those other two. I wish I had a better choice but I have no proof nor any faith that Kerry or Gore would have made things better. Nah, we'd be way more fucked! Just like if Obama wins and not Hillary.
4.15.2008 12:35pm
shep (mail):
"Nah, we'd be way more fucked! Just like if Obama wins and not Hillary."

You voted for George Bush...twice!
4.15.2008 12:37pm
shep (mail):
"But, if black people prefer African-American to just plain old American, that's up to them. I'm just glad everyone doesn't do that."

Oh, and BTW, they didn't start it. They just decided what they would prefer to be called.
4.15.2008 12:39pm
matoko_chan (mail):
juliette is l33t i think.
;)
4.15.2008 12:41pm
Jerry K. :
I'm sure people thought Lincoln was a piece of shit President back then. Now he's thought of as one of the greatest. It's fun to play the lets dump on our President game, but most of us will be long dead before the story of how great a President he actually was, has been written.
4.15.2008 12:47pm
shep (mail):
You're joking, I presume.
4.15.2008 1:19pm
IB Bill (mail):
I think the country would've been better off if Gore was president in 2000. He never would've raised spending like the GOP did, the Dems would've been forced to clean up their own economic and foreign-policy mess, the Dems' would've owned the War on Terror (and probably come up with a better name), and best of all, Gore would've been gone after one term. Right now, McCain would be running for re-election as a popular president, and Kabul, Islamabad, Baghdad, Tehran and Hanoi would be smoking ruins.
4.15.2008 1:22pm
Ara Rubyan (www):
You guys nominated Al Gore and John Kerry! Jesus, you only have yourselves to blame!

Given how it all turned out, I rest easy with that part of the story.

You're the one who screwed up.

And excuse me, it isn't "hindsight." Not only was it predictable that Bush's (re)election would be bad, it was predicted.

Eh, I will never regret picking Bush over those other two.


And that makes you qualified to comment on someone else's judgement...how?

I'm sure people thought Lincoln was a piece of shit President back then.


Oh, stop it right there, Jerry. You're insulting my intelligence. Lincoln and Bush have absolutely nothing in common, and if you'd read some history for a change, you'd have figured that out.

Read Doris Goodwin's Team of Rivals, for starters.

most of us will be long dead before the story of how great a President he actually was, has been written.

Baloney. First you compare him to Lincoln, then you say he's beyond comparing or even evaluating, as if he's some mysterious, shrouded figure that no one can possibly even begin to understand.
4.15.2008 1:23pm
shep (mail):
History happens a lot faster these days. I sure wish he was.
4.15.2008 1:23pm
Ara Rubyan (www):
the Dems would've been forced to clean up their own economic and foreign-policy mess, the Dems' would've owned the War on Terror (and probably come up with a better name), and best of all, Gore would've been gone after one term.

For starters, Gore would have been a Democratic president fighting a Republican Congress. So blaming the Dems for the "economic and foreign policy mess" in that imaginary world is just silly.

Actually no one can answer that question except Republicans looking for a way to absolve Bush of the things he actually did in the reality based world..
4.15.2008 1:25pm
IB Bill (mail):
Upon further reflection, it's unfair to blame the 2000 economic recession, caused by the tech/dot-com bubble, on the Democrats. I was thinking more "Clinton era" economic mess that really came home to roost just as Bush was taking office, but without blaming Clinton.
4.15.2008 1:34pm
IB Bill (mail):
We cross-posted. I'm not looking to absolve Dubya of anything. I don't think he's the worst president we've ever had, and I think he's been unfairly vilified. That said, I think he's certainly the most ineffective U.S. president we've had since Jimmy Carter, and probably the most ineffective two-term U.S. president in 100 years.
4.15.2008 1:42pm
double-plus-ungood (mail) (www):
It's fun to play the lets dump on our President game, but most of us will be long dead before the story of how great a President he actually was, has been written.

I've considered this possibility, but aside from some decent work in a couple of areas, the bulk of Bush's legacy will consist of:

- a complete collapse of the impressive system of US alliances built up since WW II

- a very expensive war run entirely on debt.

- a degradation in the former high moral position that the US enjoyed in the area of human rights

- a complete meltdown of US influence in the middle east, an area of extreme national importance, at the worst possible time

- the near-breaking of the US military, and a severe reduction in its use as a military deterrent and as tool of foreign policy.

- the impending severe damage to the US, and therefore global, economy

- implementing policies that have contributed to a global food crisis, and the resulting political instability that causes

In short, a lot of bad shit in a very short time period. History will not regard this administration fondly, IMO.
-

-
4.15.2008 1:55pm
double-plus-ungood (mail) (www):
Oops. Couple of ghost points there at the end. Fill in your favorite Bush administration screwup.
4.15.2008 1:56pm
Jerry K. :
Ara,

You're acting on the assumption that I think you are intelligent. That's your first mistake.

I wasn't making a comparison between Lincoln and Bush. It was just the first President's name I thought of.

The point I'm trying to make is that it doesn't matter what we think at the moment, it's how the world reacts and changes due to the actions of one man.

If the world ultimately becomes a better place in 50 to 100 years time and it gets traced back to the actions taken just after 9-11-01, people will look at George W. Bush as a Godsend. He was the only man willing to make the tough choices that made the world a better place.

We don't see it right now because we are paying $4.00 a gallon for gas, Iraq "appears" to be a mess, Iran is unstable, etc..

We're too angry, busy and stupid to see it.
4.15.2008 2:14pm
Ara Rubyan (www):
Jerry:

If the world ultimately becomes a better place in 50 to 100 years time and it gets traced back to the actions taken just after 9-11-01, people will look at George W. Bush as a Godsend.

First, I think you're the only person I know that would collide the words "Godsend" and "George W. Bush" in the same sentence. IJS.

As for your historical analysis, I prefer to live my life on this earth, in this time, in the reality based world -- not in the world to come.

Your acceptance of today (based on the hope of a better tomorrow 100 years from now) is the result of a cruel trick being played on you by those who want to steal your freedom from you now, while you are busy dreaming of the future.

Wake up, Jerry: it's time for school.

P.S. The future is now.
4.15.2008 2:28pm
IB Bill (mail):
Ah, the reality-based world. Please forgive my long quote from Uncle Screwtape:

Remember, he is not, like you, a pure spirit. Never having been a human (Oh that abominable advantage of the Enemy's!) you don't realise how enslaved they are to the pressure of the ordinary. I once had a patient, a sound atheist, who used to read in the British Museum. One day, as he sat reading, I saw a train of thought in his mind beginning to go the wrong way. The Enemy, of course, was at his elbow in a moment. Before I knew where I was I saw my twenty years' work beginning to totter. If I had lost my head and begun to attempt a defence by argument I should have been undone. But I was not such a fool. I struck instantly at the part of the man which I had best under my control and suggested that it was just about time he had some lunch. The Enemy presumably made the counter-suggestion (you know how one can never quite overhear What He says to them?) that this was more important than lunch. At least I think that must have been His line for when I said "Quite. In fact much too important to tackle it the end of a morning", the patient brightened up considerably; and by the time I had added "Much better come back after lunch and go into it with a fresh mind", he was already half way to the door. Once he was in the street the battle was won. I showed him a newsboy shouting the midday paper, and a No. 73 bus going past, and before he reached the bottom of the steps I had got into him an unalterable conviction that, whatever odd ideas might come into a man's head when he was shut up alone with his books, a healthy dose of "real life" (by which he meant the bus and the newsboy) was enough to show him that all "that sort of thing" just couldn't be true. He knew he'd had a narrow escape and in later years was fond of talking about "that inarticulate sense for actuality which is our ultimate safeguard against the aberrations of mere logic". He is now safe in Our Father's house.
4.15.2008 2:40pm
double-plus-ungood (mail) (www):
Hmm. Well, as we're quoting random entertaining stuff, from the recently resurrected FafBlog:
So for the last five years all the liberals and the hippies and the nattering nabobs of normalcy have been coming up to Giblets and going "Was the war a mistake Giblets?" and "Are we losing the war Giblets?" and "Oh look at all the dead people Giblets, maybe we should stop the war." And the correct answers to these questions have been "Shut up," "Shut up you traitor," and "We'd be winning already if you'd just shut up."
4.15.2008 2:55pm
Jerry K. :
Ara,

Thats the difference between you and me. I care about my children and the future generations of my family. It's obvious that you are just a wee bit selfish and only care about you! And you call yourself a liberal.. Shame on you..

;-)
4.15.2008 3:31pm
IB Bill (mail):
You're Canadian. Join a real country and get back to me on that.
4.15.2008 3:32pm
double-plus-ungood (mail) (www):
You're Canadian. Join a real country and get back to me on that.

Looks pretty real to me.
4.15.2008 3:45pm
Ara Rubyan (www):
Thats the difference between you and me. I care about my children and the future generations of my family.

Then surely you believe, as I do, that we don't own this world; we simply borrowed it from our parents and we'll lend it, in turn, to our kids.

It's up to us to pass it along in better condition than we got it.

[IWH]
4.15.2008 3:47pm
IB Bill (mail):
A currency converter? That's all you got?

Looks pretty fake to me. What's that -- six teams you got there? 15 years since you won the Cup? And it's your own national sport!
4.15.2008 3:55pm
double-plus-ungood (mail) (www):
A currency converter? That's all you got?

Nope. I wasn't sure what criteria you were applying, so went with what I thought the most rationale scale. Silly me.

What's that -- six teams you got there? 15 years since you won the Cup? And it's your own national sport!

Sorry, I don't follow any sports whatsoever, so you'll have to excuse me if I don't place any importance on teams, etc, as far as real national identity goes. If that's your measuring stick, we won't have much common ground.
4.15.2008 4:42pm
double-plus-ungood (mail) (www):
Isn't it cute when Bill tries to be Rosemary?
4.15.2008 4:50pm
Ara Rubyan (www):
I think he skipped a couple of training sessions.
4.15.2008 4:59pm
IB Bill (mail):
If that's your measuring stick, we won't have much common ground.

Stick, eh? Like a hockey stick? I believe Freud calls this the return of the repressed. You can run from hockey as a Canadian, but you can't hide.

Isn't it cute when Double-plus-ungood tries to be Obama?
4.15.2008 5:29pm
double-plus-ungood (mail) (www):
Here's an interesting CIA chart that I ran across today. It displays the nations of the world ranked by their account balance (basically, measures the flow of wealth into or out of a nation).

I was surprised to see Canada so high in the list, fourteenth from the top. Makes you wonder where all the money is coming from, until you look at the very bottom, at position 164.

What a legacy. Still, by hockey standards...
4.15.2008 5:48pm
IB Bill (mail):
I know $747 billion is a lot of money by Canadian standards, but that's just spare change in our pockets.

Funny thing is, we don't even like hockey that much ...
4.15.2008 6:23pm
Ara Rubyan (www):
$747 billion is a lot of money by Canadian standards, but that's just spare change in our pockets.

At this rate it's about 12 euros.
4.15.2008 6:33pm
IB Bill (mail):
Well, I have 15 years from my fall trip to France. So this year's on me.
4.15.2008 6:51pm
IB Bill (mail):
euros, not years.
4.15.2008 6:57pm
double-plus-ungood (mail) (www):
I know $747 billion is a lot of money by Canadian standards, but that's just spare change in our pockets.

In US dollars, yes, that's true.
4.15.2008 7:00pm
IB Bill (mail):
Golly, you're right, that's only $760 billion in Canadian dollars. Oh wait, there aren't $760 billion Canadian dollars.
4.15.2008 8:15pm
shep (mail):
"I think he's certainly the most ineffective U.S. president we've had since Jimmy Carter, and probably the most ineffective two-term U.S. president in 100 years."

Jimmy Carter inherited a wrecked economy in the aftermath of Vietnam leading to massive stagflation, and the failed (Shah of) Iran policy leading to the hostage crisis. Yet he managed not to start a devastating war in the ME (in fact, very nearly resolved the Israeli/Palestinian problem), took the hard steps to right the economy, set about rebuilding our decimated military and put us on a path to energy independence (which the Reagan Administration promptly reversed).

As usual, the Democrat had to fix the disaster created by the Republican (and, to be fair, in this case with major help from Democrats with regard to Vietnam) and then gets blamed for doing the hard lifting. Bad enough when when you can't see a disastrous government when it's occurring but to not be able to see with 20/20 hindsight, that's just myopic.
4.15.2008 9:25pm
Mark Adams, who's always correct, get used to it. (mail) (www):
Charlize Theron -- (South)African-American

Hindsight my ass Rose. At least not for me. Except for Zack Taylor, who was a war hero and only served 16 months, George Bush was the least experienced and/or educated man to serve in the White House except for (sorry Ara) Lincoln -- and I was making that argument in 2000 with other wingnuts who vexed me back then.

I count Ike and Grant's supreme commander status in wars where they saved this nation from destruction on the same level as Washington's, who never had the chance to serve our country as an elected official since there wasn't a country before him. The other Founding Father Presidents were also special cases but even then were better on paper than Bush(43) -- who's father had one of the best resumes.

Wilson didn't have much government experience, but he was brilliant, law degree, professor, president of Princeton all made up for his lack of pubic service as only being NJ's Governor a couple of years. Every non-war hero POTUS had more education or executive or legislative or a combination of such experiences and education.

There simply never has been someone so woefully unprepared than Bush and the one term congressman from Illinois -- who still had more understanding of how the nation was supposed to work from his legal studies, and more government experience when you count the Illinois Legislature. In this case, Obama's experience is similar, and just a bit better than Lincoln's since Barack was in the Senate and not the House, and has the formal Doctor of Jurisprudence degree and didn't just study law on his own.

Oh, Bill, even while he was POTUS, I was proud of Carter's character, his humanity, and the fact that he was a nuclear physicist. Bush can't even pronounce that. And he's fucking nuts along with his sheer arrogant stupidity. Carter tried to make things better for all of us. Bush doesn't give a fuck and is a certifiable sociopath.
4.16.2008 3:23am
Ara Rubyan (www):
All due respect, Carter couldn't pronounce "nuclear" correctly either.
4.16.2008 6:19am
Mark Adams, who's always correct, get used to it. (mail) (www):
All due respect, Carter couldn't pronounce "nuclear" correctly either.
Okay, that's just Yankee ... elitism. [IWH]

Besides, Carter could build a nuclear reactor from stone knives and bearskins ... and a lump of yellowcake. Bush would have grabbed a fork and ice cream if given the same ingredients.
4.16.2008 7:43am
IB Bill (mail):
That's quite a set of opinions you have, Shep. You have an astonishing talent for getting things exactly backward. I wonder what the problem is ... have you ever seen a therapist?
4.16.2008 7:44am
IB Bill (mail):
OK, I admit that was cranky of me. I'll try to be more civil in the future.
4.16.2008 8:28am
Ara Rubyan (www):
You wanker.

[IWH]
4.16.2008 9:25am
Ara Rubyan (www):
Okay, that's just Yankee ... elitism. [IWH]

I get that a lot from Miss Julie.
4.16.2008 9:26am
shep (mail):
"That's quite a set of opinions you have, Shep."

Just the facts, Mr. Cranky Pants. Feel free to actually, you know, refute any of them if you can.
4.16.2008 11:25am
IB Bill (mail):
Just the facts, Mr. Cranky Pants.

It's important to distinguish among presentation of facts, interpretation of facts, and opinion of how those interpretations fit into a larger context. Clearly, you have not presented "just the facts."
4.16.2008 11:33am
shep (mail):
Clearly, you got nothin' but your opinion.
4.16.2008 11:52am
IB Bill (mail):
That's your opinion.
4.16.2008 11:59am
Rosemary, Queen of All Evil (mail):
If my Dad was still alive, he'd kick your dad's ass!
4.16.2008 12:13pm
double-plus-ungood (mail) (www):
Golly, you're right, that's only $760 billion in Canadian dollars. Oh wait, there aren't $760 billion Canadian dollars.

That's okay, those aren't really $760 billion US either. They're Yuan.
4.16.2008 12:22pm
IB Bill (mail):
Do you get up late, ++UG?

That's okay, those aren't really $760 billion US either. They're Yuan.

They're Yuan what?
4.16.2008 12:30pm
double-plus-ungood (mail) (www):
Do you get up late, ++UG?

Bill, the Earth is round, which means that some parts of the planet receive daylight later than others.

Also, some of us have to get kids up, make breakfast, pack school lunches, and drive kids to school before going to work. Then our blogging schedules are dependent on time available for such activities at work.

You have a job and kids, right?

They're Yuan what?

If you don't know what the Yuan is, then you're definitely unqualified to be in this discussion.
4.16.2008 12:39pm
double-plus-ungood (mail) (www):
Here you go, Bill, this should help you get up to speed.
4.16.2008 12:43pm
IB Bill (mail):
Dude, you are really not a morning person, are you?

I know what Yuan are. I was making a little pun ... read it "one what". Never mind.

No kids, dogs or cats. Job, house, sick parents, various responsibilities, deadlines and commitments. You know how it is.

I wasn't aware, however, that the world is round. You mean like an orange? So those ships don't just fall off the earth? I knew it.

But if the world is round, what's holding it up? It can't just be floating in space ...
4.16.2008 1:02pm
double-plus-ungood (mail) (www):
Thank God Fafblog is back. Giblets addresses Bittergate:
It's time for another edition of BARACK OBAMA: THE FINAL THROES! Last week Giblets revealed the dangerous levels of pussification inherent in Obama's bowling skills and orange juice consumption while exploring the damage done by persistent rumors that the senator is secretly black. But this latest scandal has doomed the Obama campaign more than any dooming doom that has doomed it before, because this time Obama has Insulted America by saying that poor people in impoverished rural areas are somehow "bitter" about being poor and impoverished. For shame!

Well Giblets knows the real Americans of the heartland, Barack Obama. He has flown over them and driven past them and grimaced amiably in their direction on the way to hotel rooms on numerous occasions, and in that time he has come to appreciate their primitive yet unique culture. These salt-of-the-earth folk don't need your condescending liberal elitism to tell them how they feel! They need Giblets's condescending conservative elitism to tell them how they feel! These people aren't "bitter." Far from it! America's impoverished working class are a chipper and cheerful lot, prancing and scampering about their foreclosed homes and crumbling industrial sectors with a spirit of adorable pluckiness, smiling and laughing through their unemployment and their black lung disease like a pack of hardscrabble leprechauns!1 And Giblets is sure they are outraged to hear Barack Obama imply otherwise - just as he is sure they are even outraged-er to hear Obama scorn their honest midwestern folkways, mocking the simple beauty of their long, proud tradition of recreational possum-killing and their homey, heartfelt gay-bashing! Well Giblets has a long if purely theoretical love of our nation's yahoo population and their mysterious ways, and would be proud to join them himself were he not so busy wiping their hideous yokel-germs off him with copious quantities of hand sanitizer.
4.16.2008 1:33pm
IB Bill (mail):
My favorite Fafblog entry was this one:


The Wonderful World of Commerce!
"Insolent pot!" says Giblets. "Be more vendible!"
"Giblets why are you yellin at that pot plant?" says me.
"Giblets is trying to turn it into commerce," says Giblets. "But buying and selling it is too much work. He wants it to be commerce NOOOOOWWW!"
"Silly Giblets, everything is commerce!" says me. "Let's step into this maaaagical schoolbus and we will learn all about Our World Of Commerce!"
4.16.2008 1:37pm
Juliette (mail) (www):
Rosemary!

After 62 comments, who knows what's being talked about but, thanks for the link.

Give Dean a hug for me.
4.16.2008 2:05pm
Ara Rubyan (www):
Bwahahahahahaha!

That made my day.
4.16.2008 3:52pm
double-plus-ungood (mail) (www):
Give him a hug from me too, Rose.
4.16.2008 4:25pm
Ara Rubyan (www):
"My good friend Baldilocks...."

Bwahahahahahahaha!
4.16.2008 4:40pm
Mark Adams, who's always correct, get used to it. (mail) (www):
WoW -- just fucking -- WOW!
4.16.2008 5:59pm
Ara Rubyan (www):
C'mon Rose -- give him a hug for all of us!

LOL
4.16.2008 6:37pm
Rosemary, Queen of All Evil (mail):
Oh, I did. My lawyer called it a "Motion and Notice of a Hearing". Yes, I'm sure it felt like a really tight squeeze.
4.17.2008 12:21am
Mark Adams, who's always correct, get used to it. (mail) (www):
nice
4.17.2008 3:27am
matoko_chan (mail):

Give Dean a hug for me.


see?
l33tness.
4.17.2008 10:32am
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